AngryFrenchGuy

6 Myths about McGill and Concordia

with 271 comments

So here you are. You’ve left New Jersey or Bangalore behind, came to Montreal, McGill and Concordia and you are now ready to explore your new home and indulge in your new life of freedom and very loose drinking laws.

During your stay in Québec you will be expected to ingest quite enormous quantities of cheese, fries, gravy, beer and bullshit about your new home, all of which could quite understandably make you sick to your stomach if you are not careful.

Lucky for you, you’ve found the AngryFrenchGuide, the voice of reason and truth about Québec who will help you see through the fog of dinsinformation and closet francophobia that you might come accross in the streets of Montreal.

To start you off, here are a few myths about McGill and Concordia universities that you should be weary of:

1. McGill is Montreal’s only world-class university.

Although it has often claimed to have more international students than any other university in Canada and even though half of those “international” students live only a few hours down highway 15/87 in the United States, McGill only managed to attract 400 more students on a visa than l’Université de Montréal (the big yellow building that kind of looks like a mosque on top of Mount-Royal).

In 2006 McGill had 5549 international students while UdM, with it’s affiliated engineering and business schools, Polytechnique and HEC, had 5130. Every single one of those had to take an airplane to get here. Who’s world-class now?

2. Québec needs McGill and Concordia to attract young upwardly mobile students from abroad.

What is this? 1998? You guys need to get with the program.

According to the British Council, the demand for a Western English language education by international students is falling fast, especially in Asia. In 2005 4 out of 5 UK universities recorded a drop in foreign students, as sharp as 50% in the case of students from China.

Most countries in the World have adapted to the reality that English is the global language. People are learning English at home, now. They don’t need to come to Canada and the West anymore. The British Council’s conclusion: “The recent decline in international students studying in the main English-speaking countries is unlikely to reverse.”

The latest numbers from McGill tell us that although international admissions were stable this year, admissions from China, Japan, Mexico and Latin America all were down.

3. English is still the global language. There will always be a demand for an English education.

India’s outsourcing business is in crisis because it doesn’t have enough multilingual staff. They need German, Chinese and Spanish-speaking staff to get new lucrative markets. It started outsourcing the English-language business to more inexpensive places like Viet Nam, Guatemala and the State of Georgia (not the country, the US state). English is no longer a high value skill. Anyone can speak English.

The word on the street is multilinguism. You can’t graduate from Montreal’s French-language universities without a high proficiency in English. You can very easily spend four years at Concordia without learning a word of French, which makes you unemployable in Québec, and just another unilingual English-speaker in that big multilingual world out there. Maybe you can get work at that Indian call-center in Atlanta?

4. I’ve heard about you AFG, you’re one of those bitter separatists trying to wipe English out of Montreal.

There are exactly 744 430 English-speaking people in Québec, not even 10% of the population. Nevertheless Québec has three English-language universities that receive 27% of the government higher education funding, including 33% of the research budgets.

The rest of Canada has exactly ONE French university and it doesn’t have enough money to have a medical school.

You’re welcome.

5. Yeah, but Montreal’s English universities help offset the “brain drain” in Québec.

Actually, if it wasn’t for Montreal’s Anglo universities, Québec would be in a “brain gain” situation. 70% of English-speaking students leave after earning a Ph.D. Every year, wilst Québec is in the middle of a doctor shortage crisis, more than 50% of doctors trained by McGill leave the province.

Québec’s French universities can train more fluently English-speaking doctors and engineers than McGill and Concordia at a fraction of the cost. McGill and Concordia are just not good investments.

6. Fuck you AFG! English Montreal built McGill and Concordia and you separatists don’t have any business telling us who and what we should teach!

Actually, McGill and Concordia have received between a quarter and a third of all the higher education budgets of Québec for the last 40 years. They were built by the Québec people and belong to the Québec people. If the people of Québec decide they need Concordia to train people to work in Tagalog, that’s what Concordia’s should do.

So there you have it. French-speaking North Americans (3% of the continents population) are subsidizing the education of English-speaking North Americans (90% of the population). Pay attention in your your PoliSci class when the teacher will describe neo-colonial systems. You just might hear things that sound like this post.

But it’s cool, don’t worry about it. You’ve got time. Take those four years, learn some French, explore the east, make some friends and join the good fight.

And remember, don’t go back home without having that poutine. It helps keep everything down.

Written by angryfrenchguy

August 25, 2008 at 12:36 am

271 Responses

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  1. Ils l’ont-tu l’affaire, les Canadians? THINK BIG, ‘STI!

    James

    April 11, 2009 at 12:45 pm

  2. Blah-blah-blah. Why so much hate? Please remove your white hood when you spit at francophones and Montreal in general.

    Parisians thumb their noses to any accent that is not parisian. The Quebecois accent is actually considered “cute” over there, if only a little rustic.

    BTW, it’s with comments like yours that you help the cause of Quebec independence. Keep at it.

    Schmorgluf

    April 21, 2009 at 6:03 pm

  3. « Le sous-financement des universités francophones »

    ‘Alors que plus de 85 % des nouveaux arrivants et des allophones s’installent dans la région de Montréal, il est aberrant que les universités francophones à Montréal emploient seulement 43 % des professeurs (57 % pour les universités anglophones).

    ‘Globalement, les universités de langue française au Québec ne reçoivent environ que 75 % des subventions du gouvernement québécois et 65 % du financement fédéral, alors que les Québécois non anglophones représentent 92 % de la population. C’est pourquoi une majorité d’étudiants allophones étudient en anglais à l’Université.’

    texte intégral: http://lautjournal.info/default.aspx?page=3&NewsId=1544

    James

    April 25, 2009 at 11:55 pm

  4. No, at the time of your posting, 10/23/2008, he was the world’s second richest person. The world’s first richest was Warren Buffet. He had only been the richest man during some parts of 2007. You need to open your eyes. You clearly have some form of hatred of Anglo’s. So much hatred, that you even twist facts to get your opinion across.

    Now, I’m going to give you a little slap in the face for all your spineless insults. The reason why French isn’t the Lingua Franca is because you lost the bloody war! France is worse than Poland and Belgium. Both countries did not ‘give up’ so easily. France built an incredibly stupid Maginot Line and once Germany just ‘walked around it’ through Belgium, they surrendered and sided with the Nazis (Vichy France).

    Cowards.

    To argue that English is not the Lingua Franca, is quite ludicrous. Even China, is increasing the amount of English speaking people.

    The only thing evident in your post is ignorant frustration. Feel free to stay in Quebec, as it is in vast amounts of debt and the most poor province in Canada. Ironically, it also has the highest provincial tax. Where does the money go?

    Maybe you should move, you bloody moron.

    Eddie

    April 27, 2009 at 4:32 pm

  5. « OPÉRATION McGill FRANÇAIS en 2009? »

    ‘Pourquoi donc le quarantième anniversaire de l’opération McGill français est-il passé si inaperçu? Les choses se sont tellement améliorées que personne ne sente le besoin d’en parler?

    ‘Et si ce silence n’était que le reflet d’un manque de souffle de la part d’une majorité de moins en moins capable de se prendre en mains? Opération McGill français en 2009? Forget about it – Oubliez-ça !’

    texte intégral:

    http://lautjournal.info/default.aspx?page=3&NewsId=1550

    James

    April 28, 2009 at 7:13 pm

  6. AFG: The tone of your article and particularly in regard to point 6 suggests that English speaking people and allophones who don’t speak French are not Quebecers, that by implication, Quebecers are “subsidising” non-quebecers. The premis of your blog appears to be that that Montreal can be a successful open and attractive international city without McGill and Concordia. I’m sure most people would agree, but that most people would also say that Montreal and its citizens would be the poorer for it in every sense of the word, economically, socially, artistically, research-wise etc.

    Finally, far from receiving huge subsidies from the province, if you did a bit more research into funding towards Quebec universities I’m sure you would find relatively little provincial funding is given for capital investment (much is provided by private doners, ex-alumni, and other non-provincial funding) unlike UdeM or UQAM, and that at best the English speaking universities receive standard amounts per student for fees, and non-Quebec Canadian students and international students are required to pay significantly more in fees.

    Also to note is that a very significant proportion of the students at McGill and UQAM are francophone and choose to learn at these institutions in part to ensure their language skills. If they wanted to go to a francophone institution they have that right and can vote with their feet. Would you prefer that their freedom of choice was limited or that they had to leave the province for their education?

    Finally, there is a long history of both institutions in the city of Montreal. McGill is Montreal’s oldest university and has made a long and rich contribution to the prosperity of the city and its people, English and French speaking, and continues to do this. Concordia has also risen in importance and is doing very well at the moment. Restricting or closing McGill or Concordia would achieve what exactly? Will UdeM or UQAM suddenly become world class and world famous as a consequence. Nonsense. They have to earn their international respect as do all such institutions, and UdeM is most definately doing so – good for them. However, limiting or closing McGill or UQAM would only diminish Montreal’s reputation as a place of learning, openness, etc. Such a scenario can only be in the mind of a society or persons with great prejudice towards non-francophones, a highly zenophobic mindset which is very dangerous.

    I would also like to think that Quebec considers its English speaking citizens as full members of the province and not as second-class members to be tolerated and taxed, but without full rights to maintain its historic or new institutions.

    In regard to francophone universities outside of Quebec, you did not refer to U of Ottawa, which is a bilingual university (predating Laval and UdeM as a degree granting institution) with a medical school. The UofO is having big problems currently attracting sufficient francophone students to maintain course numbers, despite its catholic French-speaking roots, with most of its senior staff being francophone, with much promotion efforts and funding support. The problem simply is demographic, that there are relatively few francophones in Canada outside Quebec to justify the support of large francophone-only university institutions.

    Finally, as a suggestion, perhaps UdeM should explore developing satelite french speaking institutions across Canada, perhaps affiliated with other Canadian universities. UBC was founded this way as a satellite of McGill.

    JPW

    May 24, 2009 at 10:57 am

  7. Thank you for your fine sample of the reductive paternalistic and anglocentric mindset that will eventually, in due time, completely isolate the world’s English-speaking community from the rest of our globalized planet.

    McGill is Québec’s only world class university? Well, I guess if you defined the world strictly to English-speaking people who live in half a dozen former british colonies, yes, it would be the only one.

    Next time you spend half an hour replying to a blog post, try to avoid redundantly raising objections already adressed by the post author.

    Be Well.

    angryfrenchguy

    May 25, 2009 at 8:53 am

  8. JPW

    Your post was both eloquent and factual and that is certainly not going to get you anywhere on this page. Angryfrenchguy and his cohorts will do nothing other than insult and malign you.

    As for your quote:
    “I would also like to think that Quebec considers its English speaking citizens as full members of the province and not as second-class members to be tolerated and taxed, but without full rights to maintain its historic or new institutions.”

    Well Quebec does not and has not considered its English citizens or any other language group that isn’t pure laine… full members of the province. It hasn’t since the good old FLQ days. Its ethnocentric behavior is now firmly entrenched as its raison d’etre.

    Didi

    May 25, 2009 at 6:22 pm

  9. Didi, honestly, you gotta be kidding. The most well treated minority in the world is the english speaking quebeckers.

    If you dont want to be part of this society that is called Quebec then that’s your choice but the anglo’s i know (many of them) feel very comfortable in this society. Plus, they can even live their entire life without having to ”deal” with the majority of the population which is ny book is idiotic not to say raicist but it also show’s how well treated they are.

    In this case AFG only questions the fundings of McGill university and i think it has to be done. NcGill is indeed a worldwide known university but it is somewhat condescendant that some english speaking people see’s it as the only world class university.

    Anyway, didi…..watch when you go out of the house today, you may very well here some people speaking french….and of course, they will be totally ethno-centric and ready to blast you !!!

    Steve_36

    May 26, 2009 at 9:51 am

  10. Steve,
    Your ‘best treated minority in the world’ comment says it all. If you knew anything about racism and its horrific results, you’d understand that classifying any member of any society into any kind of class – OTHER THAN EQUAL – it is racism and discrimination.
    But then again you may not know that because Quebec schools no longer educate their students about ethnic cleansing history. I’ve lost count of the number of francophone youth I’ve met who have absolutely no knowledge of Hitler or the Nazi Party!!!! That kind of deliberate education denial is about as sick as it gets!
    So maybe that’s why YOU don’t consider the ethno-centric ideology of Quebec – as terrible.

    And one more thing – you silly little goose, don’t prattle on to me about – whether or not I want to be part of Quebec society. I’ve been a part of it a hell of a lot longer than you my child. Go grow up – learn some history (other than the racist babble you’ve been brainwashed into believing) and get back to me in a few years.

    Didi

    May 27, 2009 at 12:58 pm

  11. No i won’t answer you in a few years but right away. My jewish friend would punch you in the face right away for simply trying to link the modern Quebec society with the ”nazi” and ”hitler” eras. This is completely foolish and just shows what kind of idiot you can be. This twisted mind of yours is based on piure racism from your part simply because you are not happy to be able to control all aspect of this modern thriving society that we live in. It is time ti grow up and share the space you live in with the majority. The good old says where you use to spit on the majority of people is long gone, just in India, Hong Kong and other places in the world. You obviously dont know what racism is all about.

    You havent been part of this society at all, you have been living in your own world thinking of the good old days, that’s very different. The world is changing, Montreal has changed and the old redneck like you are not alone in the ring anymore….wether you like it or not.

    You haven’t been able to show one single element where this society is ethno-centric except trying to make it look like a Nazi regime. How pathetic!

    Why the federal goverment’s comissionner of official language, Graham Fraser, keep coming back year after year to show how the french is not being respected in most of Canada’s ? The latest example being in Vancouver…..as if they will be able to give the service to french peoplee…hahahahihihih What a joke !

    But for you, that is Ok, right didi ?

    As if english people are not able to be served properly in their language in the greater Montreal area.

    If it’s so bad why didn’t you leave with the 500 000 anglos who left in the 70’s ? I know i wouldn’t want to live in an ethno-centric world.

    Everybody is equal in Quebec and everybody has to respect the laws gthat have been voted just like in the rest of Canada or the USA, to name a few. Are these countries ”nazi” and ”ethno-centric” ?

    Steve_36

    May 27, 2009 at 1:27 pm

  12. Well Steve,
    Your “Why didn’t you leave” comment speaks for itself.
    Over 500,000 non francophones FLED the province and you dare to say ALL are Equal in Quebec? So half a million people didn’t and millions more DON’T agree with you or this gouvernements… blatant discrimination and REMOVAL OF RIGHTS… and you dare to SPOUT everyone other than YOU IS WRONG?? Like I said – go do some learning – and get back to me when you bloody well get a heart!

    By the way – I’m Jewish – so don’t spout your ignorant garbage to me!!

    Didi

    May 27, 2009 at 8:02 pm

  13. Well if you are jewish then you are blatant ignorant to dare compare today’s Quebec society with the Nazi era……believe me, if it would be only one tenth of the shadow of something that may sound like the Nazi era then there wouldn’t be a jew left in this city nor many immigrants at all but it looks like it ain’t so bad because Montreal is becoming a huge multi-cultural city that includes most of the people, races and ethnic groups that can be found on this planet including jews from all horizons. Ashkenazi, Sepharadic, Hassidims etc…. Not so bad for an ethno centric province right ?

    As far as the 500 000 people who left the city/province in the late 70’s…well, you are, once again, completely wrong on that. You are using even worst than the numbers that we’re already hyped by the english organisations and the Gazette in order to mislead people about the numbers of people fleeing the province. Their hyped number was approximately 300 000 and the reality is much closer to 125 000 which many people came back especially since their children rediscovered Montreal and they much prefer living in the Mile end area (per example) than any other places in Canafda. Not so bad for an ethno=centric racist province isn’t ?

    How do you explain the constant rising in the Quebec population despite having lost the 500 000 people you talk about ?

    During the same time more than 300 000 people left Philaadelphie for the west coast. St-Louis, Detroit, Baltimore, Chicago and Cleveland all lost more people than Montreal and even New york coity lost nearly 750 000 but it doesn’t show much with them thanks to the immigration. So, all these places are considered racist ethno-centric , Didi ?

    No, the truth is that part of the people are mobile and simply head west for a better economical life when they think they can get it.

    Admit it didi, you are damn mad that the old red necks aren’t rulling this province like they use to, right ? You are frustrated about that, right ? Dont be ashame, just admit it, maybe we can help you…..

    The good old days Didi…..i miss them to. Remember when John Lennon, the leader of the peace in the world, came to Montreal……MONTREAL Didi…..to sign is signature song and to do his bed in. Would you say that John would have come here if the province and city was racist and ethno-centric ? Dop you think the olympic organisation and the world fair organisations would have chosen Montreal if it was filled with racist ethno-centric, didi ?

    How bout Leonard Cohen, not only did he choose to remain in Montreal but moved from Westmount to Plateau. The same with the Bronfman, the Weider, Phyllis lambert, the Molsons and many other great montrealers…….they chose to live and stay here despite doing business worldwide. They would have done so if it was like the Nazi era and the leader would ressemble Hitler ? That’s what you are saying good old didi ?

    Steve_36

    May 27, 2009 at 10:58 pm

  14. Still lying your head off I see. Still denying the facts as usual. And your Leonard Cohen and John Lennon examples are as ridiculous as it gets. They were here during the normal times. As for the Bronfman’s and other’s …. what’s your point? So they stayed. So did I and so have many others. It does nothing to negate the half a million who felt they had to FLEE!!! Or who could afford to FLEE!

    You can screech and deny all you like. I doubt too many readers will take YOUR word about the English – as gospel – mon ami.
    Another note… Jean Drapeau was mayor of Montreal in 67… and when things were also still NORMAL!! The exodus began when the Parti Quebecois took power. In any event – keep ranting and raving your nonsense. It just validates everything I write.

    One final question: Why since the PQ took power – are school children denied holocost information? How come they don’t know who Hitler is?

    Anonymous

    May 29, 2009 at 4:03 pm

  15. Well, the last one was sign anonymous but for a reason i am 110% sure it’s you didi…i mean you’re the only one who can come up with foolish Quebec bashing and see Nazi and Hitler all over this province…..right ?

    So since the PQ took over they are not ”teaching” kids about holocost and Hitler in school,right ? That’s so funny didi….i can’t believe it ! Have a bagel or something will you !!!

    Leonard Cohen was here then but he his still here Didi……he loves it here. He actually lives in the portuguese area near St-Laurent boulevard. The guy is great. I love him. Amazing artist.

    Now, have you heard the latest. Mitch Garber, a very intelligent and affluent Mntreal lawyer who’s maing it in the world….the World didi !!! He just got an offer from Las Vegas Harrah’s in order to take over the internet gambling division. He agreed to the offer as long as they move their head office in Montreal because he wanted to come back in the city, have his kids grow up here and go to school etc….

    Amazing isn’t it. The guy is a ”pure” anglo montrealer and for a reason i don’t think he see’s many Nazi roaring around the street of this province…unlike you didi. But it’s ok Didi. You can see Nazi and Hitler all over the place, this could be treated you know.

    Once again on the news today i heard Phillys Lambert passionately talk about saving the Mount-Royal park because their planning condo’s or something. She’s great. I mean she’s the best thing that ever happened to Montreal as far as architecture, patrimonial and old historical buildings and sites. She’s the best.
    But for a reason, i doubt that she has to hide at night from the ethno-centric nazi types that are chasing anglos et other non pure laine people…..i just don’t think she’s going trough such paranoiac state of mind…unlike you didi.

    So, tell me didi, why did you choose to stay in Montreal or in this province and didn’t leave like the millions that have supposedly left in the 70’s ? Explain that to me didi ?

    Steve_36

    May 29, 2009 at 10:35 pm

  16. Of course it was me that answered you. I have no idea why my handle didn’t register. But rest assured I have no problem putting my name on any of my posts.

    Now as for your examples of Phyliss Lambert et al… you do know they all have homes all over the map – and have all the money they need to get out of Quebec forever in a minute if they need to. And of course they love Montreal … just as I do. After all it is their home and mine. The pequistes and pure laines screechers (like you??) believe they must speak and learn your sacred language – while English has been made non official and all that other racist discriminatory bile.

    And again you IGNORE the fact that francophone children and young people in their 20’s etc… have NO IDEA WHO HITLER IS!!! When I ask them – they are totally puzzled and answer no they don’t know – nor do they know about the horrors of WWII.

    And the reason I’m here is none of your damn business. I’m sure you’d be delighted if I moved lol. Another anglo chased out of PQ right?
    In your dreams

    Didi

    May 30, 2009 at 11:30 am

  17. Of course i knew it was you didi. Nobody else in this world keep bringing Hitler and the Nazi as example of today’s Quebec society…nobody except paranoiac sick people.

    Yes, good example as for Phillys lambert and all the others above mnentionned hich love Montreal and they all have enough money to live anywhere else in the world, that is why if they choose and decide to stay and remain here one only assumes that it must be very pleasant to live here, no ?

    Be careful before calling me a ”pure laine screecher”, you would be surprise. You may even have more pure lain blood than i do…

    If english is non official it is only to try to make a balance beetwen the world wide language spoken by 300 000 million people in north america and 25 millions in Canada while the 80% of the people in Quebec speak french which is very fragilised in the north american environment. It is only normal that the goverment puts some boundaries in order to protect and promote the french language and your way of twitsing things just shows yoydo not wisdh to participate at all in this now modern thriving society where french is the main language which doesnt exclude others at all especially english speaking people.

    If it was so bad didi, why are they even building a mega english speaking university hospital with the upcomung CUSM. Not only do the english speaking population have not 1, not 2 but 3 well established english university but there is going to be a mega hospital on top of several recognised english speaking hospital. Explain that to me. Why didn’t the ethno-centric pequistes never closed all of these institution down ?

    I have some american friends, libanese friends, english canadian friends and belgian friends and all of their children dont know who the fuck Hitler is. It is simply how it is. They are 14, 17, 20, 22 years old didi. Hitler was 65/70 years ago. For you it’s yesterday but for them it’s like Napoleon or George washington for you. Eventually they will get to it if interested. No school nowhere in north american will they teach who Hitler unless in you take history courses. Didi, wake up, we are in 2009. These same quebecois kids dont know who Jacques Cartier, Samuel de Champlain, De Maisonneuve, Maurice Richard nor John Molson or Peter McGill. It’s a different world for them. Today’s school dont teach these things unless in history.

    You really have to be kidding to expect teenagers or young twentyish to know about these things. They dont care, they want to know about Britney Spears, Madonna and the latest pop singers.

    Do you want to go to a New York city high school or college or even univerisity, you’ll be surprise to find out how few people have a clue about Hilter. The blacks will know about Malcolm X, Luther King or Muhammed Ali but they wont know, unless very interested in history. Does that make them caist ethno-centric ? I don’t think so, it is simply the world we live in, the modern day world which tends to forget the old world. Sad but true.

    I dont care if you move or stay didi, you do as you wish. It’s a free world we live in and the ones who loves Quebec are welcome to stay for as long as they want and the ones who hate it here then they can easily go anywhere they want.

    Steve_36

    May 30, 2009 at 10:55 pm

  18. Do you mean to tell everyone that you believe NOT teaching history in school is acceptable? That because kids are more interested in Brittany Spears – history should be removed from schools?

    Are you for real? God help us all.

    Didi

    May 31, 2009 at 12:41 pm

  19. I think they should all teach history in school, to start with the Quebec history and then on…but if they aren’t doing it as much as we would like it it isn’t because of the PQ, it is because of our society, it’s the same in Ontario, BC, Illinois, Florida or anywhere else in north america.

    I know this is probablyt ook hard for you to understand Didi, you prefer to think it is the enthno-centric racist pequiste that have removed history because…well because they dont want our kids to know who Hitler was…..

    You are funny and i have to take it that way….otherwise i’d think you are really an idiot and a stupid paranoiac but i dont think it is your case….now, more than ever, i think you are a funny guy.

    Keep going Didi…..we need guys like you.

    Steve_36

    May 31, 2009 at 9:23 pm

  20. You say schools in Canada and the US don’t teach about the holocaust? Wrong again my boy. The one province that does NOT teach it is Quebec!! And of course it’s taught in the US schools!!
    Take a look at Canada’s educational system about it and maybe you’ll learn something. Mind you, it may be too hard for you to concentrate long enough to read it in its entirety.
    ¤ CURRICULUM DOCUMENTS — MINISTRY/DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION
    There is no federal education ministry and therefore no national curriculum in Canada. Each province sets its own guidelines for programs from Kindergarten to Grade 12. Although each province follows different curricular conceptions, the Holocaust is most often taught in the high school History program (Social Studies, or World Issues).
    Courses in the History curriculum are described by themes. With some slight variations among each of the provinces, the goals are defined as “concepts, knowledge, and skills” or “abilities and values” or “curriculum outcomes or expectations.” Teacher activity guides developed by the various Ministries provide detail in achieving the education outcomes of the different courses through activities that focus on specific concepts and provide instructional guidance for the teacher. For example, Saskatchewan’s Teacher’s Activity Guide for World Issues includes worksheets designed to assist students in problem solving, dialectical thinking and independent learning. Guides are developed by each provincial Ministry/Department in order to meet the specific curriculum outcomes as described by the individual ministries. Most often these guides include student information sheets, background information on specific areas of the course, knowledge objectives, skills development and values issues. They may also include time lines, charts, maps, a glossary and other resource information. All school boards in the specific province receive the curriculum guidelines as they are developed.
    Teaching about the Holocaust falls under various themes such as Social Responsibility and Global Citizenship, World Issues, Human Rights, or Diversity Education. Of the ten provinces and one territory that responded to the survey and sent the appropriate curriculum documents dealing with the Holocaust, three provinces (Nova Scotia, New Brunswick and British Columbia) sent copies of their Holocaust
    teacher’s guides/resource kit which have been distributed to each of their respective school boards. Five provinces (Alberta, Newfoundland and Labrador, Ontario, Quebec and Saskatchewan) sent copies of their History curriculum guides. In Alberta, Ontario and Saskatchewan the word “Holocaust” is specifically mentioned in the curriculum for Social Studies/World Issues. In the History curriculum for Newfoundland and Labrador there were references to the “Nazi persecution of the Jews” but the word Holocaust appeared only in the reference section under “World Wide Web Sites for 20th Century History.” The word “Holocaust” did not appear in the curriculum documents that were received from the province of Quebec.
    Two provinces and one territory (Manitoba, Prince Edward Island, and the Yukon) stated that they do not have curriculum documents or specific polices related to Holocaust education. However, Manitoba is currently involved in the development of new Social Studies curricula. As described in their letter in response to our survey Manitoba writes that they do not currently have a policy specifically related to Holocaust education, but that “anti-racist/anti-bias education has been defined as one of several elements that must be incorporated into all new curricula.” (Manitoba, Education and Training, letter to Dr. Karen Mock, June 27, 2000). In Prince Edward Island the Ministry wrote “all of the new curriculum guides and related documents do contain sections on Diversity Education and on valuing of social and cultural diversity.” (Department of Education, Prince Edward Island, letter to Dr. Karen Mock, July 4, 2000). In the Yukon most of the courses within the secondary system follow the B.C. curriculum.
    Like Manitoba, Quebec is reviewing the curriculum at the senior level. Currently there is an optional course on the Second World War for grade 11 students in which the question of human rights is one of the topics. All of the current programs in Quebec are under review and will replaced by the new curriculum.
    In each of the Ministry documents, where the Holocaust was specifically identified, it was an optional topic within the history curriculum. In some of the documents it was one of a number of examples that could be discussed in relation to such topics as human rights abuses, or awareness of citizenship responsibilities. In Ontario, for example, the Holocaust was cited as one example of conflict and cooperation (Ontario Canadian and World Studies , grades 11 and 12). In Alberta, the Holocaust is included in “Related Facts and Content” of World War Two (Alberta, Social Studies 10-20-30). In Saskatchewan the Holocaust was part of Related Facts and Content” of World War Two (Alberta, Social Studies 10-20-30). In Saskatchewan the Holocaust was part of “Content” in the discussion on “Human Rights” (Saskatchewan, Social Studies 20, World Issues). However, the inclusion of the Holocaust as a topic of study in the history curriculum is not mandatory.

    “Related Facts and Content” of World War Two (Alberta, Social Studies 10-20-30). In Saskatchewan the Holocaust was part of “Content” in the discussion on “Human Rights” (Saskatchewan, Social Studies 20, World Issues). However, the inclusion of the Holocaust as a topic of study in the history curriculum is not mandatory.
    ¤ TEACHING THE HOLOCAUST — SCHOOLS BOARDS
    Respondents to the survey in school boards in New Brunswick, Saskatchewan and British Columbia all agreed that the Holocaust is included in the high school curriculum (grades 9, 10,11,12). However, in other provinces there seemed some uncertainty as to whether the Holocaust is included or not. There were disparate answers to the question “Is the Holocaust presently included in the curriculum?” Even in provinces where provincial curriculum documents expressly identify the Holocaust as an example of a situation where human rights were not protected (Social Studies/World Issues curriculum) some respondents wrote the Holocaust was not in the curriculum. One respondent explained that the Holocaust “as not a separate unit of study.” Others commented “we follow the curriculum.” Another respondent wrote “There is no specific goal for the district or the Ministry. Teachers believe in the importance of understanding the Holocaust and are committed to teach it. Some do it in more depth than others.” In a few cases, schools within the same school board responded differently to the question. (See Table: Holocaust Education in Canada, National Survey, 2000 in the Appendix). It is clear that the curriculum is used as a guide and not a mandatory list.
    In response to the question “What is the goal of your Holocaust education program?” respondents wrote that they include the Holocaust in their programs in order to inform and sensitize students so that they will understand the horrors of racism and apply these lessons to current events such as the denial of human rights.
    From Newfoundland and Labrador to British Columbia, teachers who included the Holocaust in their programs felt that awareness of the cataclysmic events of the Holocaust presented many important lessons. These were described as follows:
    Students need to be critically aware of:
    • the effects and horrors of racism, prejudice and antisemitism, and the human capacity for evil;
    • the early warning signs of racism in order to avoid making the mistakes of the past;
    • the moral lessons necessary to make our society more humane;
    • the commitment to anti-racism education;
    • the development of an attitude of tolerance and understanding.
    In the responses received from the questionnaire Holocaust education is seen as an important opportunity for teachers to emphasize the meaningfulness of human rights. A history teacher in an Ontario school board wrote that his goal in teaching the Holocaust is to “develop empathy so that future genocides are not acceptable and to make students aware of the multiple genocides in the twentieth century alone.” Another history teacher in Saskatchewan wrote: “The goal of our Holocaust education program is to learn where racism can ultimately lead, to learn the potential dangers of conformity and to learn about the importance of upholding individual rights and freedoms and the rule of law.” In Nova Scotia, one respondent wrote:
    The goals of Holocaust Education Programs are to provide students with an understanding of the prevalence of Nazi-driven anti-Semitism during the WWII period, develop within students, an appreciation of Jewish culture and to foster students’ commitment to anti-racism education and the development of a tolerant and diverse society.
    Race Relations Co-ordinator, Nova Scotia School Board
    The inclusion of the Holocaust most often occurred as part of thematic units on human rights, minorities, World War II or Religious Studies. Whether the Holocaust is actually integrated into these units depends on the individual teacher. Some History courses at the senior level (grades 12) may include the topic as either as separate unit or even as a course (See British Columbia) but courses at this level are optional and so students will not necessarily have the opportunity to learn about the Holocaust.
    The amount of time that was spent on the Holocaust varied from school to school and from teacher to teacher. This reflects the fact that the Holocaust is neither mandatory nor even a separate unit within the existing provincial curricula. As one teacher put it: “The Holocaust has been included in my course for all of the fifteen years that I have taught history”. Once again, the individual teacher plays a significant role in whether and how the Holocaust is included in actual classroom instruction. In the questionnaires that were received, the average amount of time that was spent on teaching the Holocaust was just two to five hours.
    The majority of boards relied on their own school libraries or public libraries for materials to assist in teaching the Holocaust. Where possible, a number of boards made use of guest speakers, particularly survivors, to enhance their lessons. Schools located near resources such as Jewish Community Centres, Holocaust Museums and Universities, did take advantage of the opportunities to be involved in programs and make use of the resources that these facilities offer.

    Didi

    June 1, 2009 at 10:40 am

  21. Oh didi, your the best. Ar first i thought you had written all of that by yourself…..and i quickly realised it was coming from the B’Nai brith, of course. But it’s funny because nowhere it says Quebec doesn’t teach holocaust and nowhere it shows that others are teaching it. It only show that some provinces have responded to a survey with the word holocaust in it while several provinces didn’t include the word holocaust.

    Now explain to me, if you will, if these provinces and territories are ethno-centric and racists and anti-this and anti-that based on that ?

    ”Two provinces and one territory (Manitoba, Prince Edward Island, and the Yukon) stated that they do not have curriculum documents or specific polices related to Holocaust education.”

    And what about that: ”In the History curriculum for Newfoundland and Labrador there were references to the “Nazi persecution of the Jews” but the word Holocaust appeared only in the reference section under “World Wide Web Sites for 20th Century History.” ”

    Does that make them ethno-centric and racist and anti-semite etc. ?

    But you also forgot to copy parts of the B’Nai Brith article which says:

    ”In 1976 the Montreal Holocaust Memorial Centre was opened. Since its inception, the Centre has been involved in outreach to schools, and education including symposiums for college students held in English and French, and conferences for educators. It also offers lectures and guided tours of the Museum that welcomes more than 10,000 visitors each year. Recently the Centre received a grant from the federal government to expand it facilities. The funds will contribute to the development of the museum to teach about and commemorate the Holocaust.”

    That’s not so bad for an etnho-centric province and let me remind you that it was done undet he PQ goverment…..

    But also this: ” HOLOCAUST MEMORIAL DAY ACTS — PROVINCIAL GOVERNMENTS
    Ten provinces (Alberta, British Columbia, Manitoba, New Brunswick, Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, Ontario, Prince Edward Island, Quebec, Saskatchewan) have declared the Holocaust an official Memorial Day.”

    And then this: ”At McGill University’s Faculty of Education in Montreal, they have offered a course called Teaching the Holocaust once every second year for the past eight years. The course focuses on the history of the period and pedagogical considerations. For the past decade, McGill University was the only Faculty of Education to offer a course specifically on teaching the Holocaust. A few universities across Canada hold workshops or one-day seminars to which public school students and/or teachers are invited to attend. These are usually held in conjunction with the local community-based Holocaust Education and Memorial Centre.”

    As far as i know McGill is part of Quebec….and if it is the only university in all of Canada to offer a course specifically teaching the Holocaust, does that makes all of the rest anti-semite and ethno-centric didi ?

    And another thing you forgot to copy and paste from the B’Nai brith article: ” In 1987 the Montreal Holocaust Memorial Centre prepared a 27 page Teachers’ Guide to the Montreal Holocaust Memorial Centre: An Inter-disciplinary Approach. It was specifically designed to complement an exhibit at the Centre called “Children of the Holocaust.” The Montreal Holocaust Memorial Centre is planning a revised teacher’s guide in both English and French for late spring 2001.”

    How about thst didi ?

    I only visited the same page as you did, i didnù,t even go in the school’s history program because it differs from one place or another for all kinds of reasons and it doesn’t really matter because you are wearing glasses which are looking for anti-semite ethno centric racist somewhere in Quebec……i know your type !

    You are a frustrated man and you dont accept that the french population have climbed the latter of success and have taken their place in this society, that alone is too much for you and it makes you so frustrated that you dedicate your life to find anti-semite bastards all over Quebec.

    You are evel allowed to do so didi…..it doesn’t really matter, we understand your paranoiac problem and we even accept it for what it was.

    In the meat time, in the real Quebec world, in today’s thriving Quebec society …there are people that are living and enjoying in of the best society there is in the world:

    The Gazette published, few weeks ago, an reunion of ”The boys of De Bullion street” which consisted mainly of older jewish man coming back to the place where they grew up and the best place on earth…according to them !

    Then, Dustin Hoffman is coming to Montreal for a movie to be shot late summer. The movie is about a jewish boy growing in up Montreal’s Mile end. Dustin said he loves coming in Montreal but not as much as my good old friend Jackie Mason which keeps coming to Montreal for the best smoked meat in the world. He prefers Lester Smoked meat. I have been several time and i like it a lot althought a little expensive.

    But all of these people are so blind that they cant even see the ethno-centric attitude of the Quebec people…..only you, didi, can see that trough your special glasses……

    Will you let me wear them one day, i’d love to see all those ethno-centric racist bastards all over this province ?

    Steve_36

    June 1, 2009 at 11:37 am

  22. Didi: Since you seem more interested in your personal jewish issues (i assume you are jewish since you told me) then about other historical fatcs in Quebec, such as Champlain, Jacques-Cartier, Jean-talon, Iberville or other Quebec issues then i will play that game with you……i’d love to Didi.

    Maybe we can meet in Outremont, near the Hassidim synagogue, and talk about it. They have a kosher bakery and their bagel is great…….we will discuss how terrible this society is while watching this amazing thriving Hassidim community do their own thing. I love it !

    Will you meet me ?

    I know it isn’t much about copying long lasting articles about this or that but it is the real world….so maybe you are not interested in the REAL world didi, am i wrong ?

    Steve_36

    June 1, 2009 at 11:49 am

  23. Steve,

    You prattle on about: “HOLOCAUST MEMORIAL DAY ACTS — PROVINCIAL GOVERNMENTS
    Ten provinces (Alberta, British Columbia, Manitoba, New Brunswick, Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, Ontario, Prince Edward Island, Quebec, Saskatchewan) have declared the Holocaust an official Memorial Day.”

    That has absolutely NOTHING to do with Quebec NOT teaching about the Holocaust in its schools. In Quebec – it is offered as an elective – in Grade 11!!!! And that’s it. And as for the Memorial Day – that you preen about… it is something new… and if Quebec had NOT gone along with the other provinces – its antisemitism would have stood out like a sore thumb. So stick to the subject we were discussing – and address that if you can.

    Note: NOT IN QUEBEC:
    Teaching about the Holocaust falls under various themes such as Social Responsibility and Global Citizenship, World Issues, Human Rights, or Diversity Education. Of the ten provinces and one territory that responded to the survey and sent the appropriate curriculum documents dealing with the Holocaust, three provinces (Nova Scotia, New Brunswick and British Columbia) sent copies of their Holocaust
    teacher’s guides/resource kit which have been distributed to each of their respective school boards.

    Five provinces (Alberta, Newfoundland and Labrador, Ontario, Quebec and Saskatchewan) sent copies of their History curriculum guides.

    NOT IN QUEBEC: In Alberta, Ontario and Saskatchewan the word “Holocaust” is specifically mentioned in the curriculum for Social Studies/World Issues. In the History curriculum for Newfoundland and Labrador there were references to the “Nazi persecution of the Jews” but the word Holocaust appeared only in the reference section under “World Wide Web Sites for 20th Century History.”

    NOT IN QUEBEC: The word “Holocaust” did not appear in the curriculum documents that were received from the province of Quebec.

    Teaching about the Holocaust falls under various themes such as Social Responsibility and Global Citizenship, World Issues, Human Rights, or Diversity Education. Of the ten provinces and one territory that responded to the survey and sent the appropriate curriculum documents dealing with the Holocaust, three provinces (Nova Scotia, New Brunswick and British Columbia) sent copies of their Holocaust
    teacher’s guides/resource kit which have been distributed to each of their respective school boards.

    Five provinces (Alberta, Newfoundland and Labrador, Ontario, Quebec and Saskatchewan) sent copies of their History curriculum guide.

    NOT IN QUEBEC: In Alberta, Ontario and Saskatchewan the word “Holocaust” is specifically mentioned in the curriculum for Social Studies/World Issues. In the History curriculum for Newfoundland and Labrador there were references to the “Nazi persecution of the Jews” but the word Holocaust appeared only in the reference section under “World Wide Web Sites for 20th Century History.”

    NOT IN QUEBEC!!!: The word “Holocaust” did not appear in the curriculum documents that were received from the province of Quebec.

    NOT IN QUEBEC: Respondents to the survey in school boards in New Brunswick, Saskatchewan and British Columbia all agreed that the Holocaust is included in the high school curriculum (grades 9, 10,11,12).

    NOTHING FROM QUEBEC: NOT IN QUEBEC: In response to the question “What is the goal of your Holocaust education program?” respondents wrote that they include the Holocaust in their programs in order to inform and sensitize students so that they will understand the horrors of racism and apply these lessons to current events such as the denial of human rights.

    NOTHING FROM QUEBEC: NOT IN QUEBEC: From Newfoundland and Labrador to British Columbia, teachers who included the Holocaust in their programs felt that awareness of the cataclysmic events of the Holocaust presented many important lessons. These were described as follows:
    Students need to be critically aware of:
    • the effects and horrors of racism, prejudice and antisemitism, and the human capacity for evil;
    • the early warning signs of racism in order to avoid making the mistakes of the past;
    • the moral lessons necessary to make our society more humane;
    • the commitment to anti-racism education;
    • the development of an attitude of tolerance and understanding.

    NOT IN QUEBEC: In the responses received from the questionnaire Holocaust education is seen as an important opportunity for teachers to emphasize the meaningfulness of human rights. A history teacher in an Ontario school board wrote that his goal in teaching the Holocaust is to “develop empathy so that future genocides are not acceptable and to make students aware of the multiple genocides in the twentieth century alone.” Another history teacher in Saskatchewan wrote: “The goal of our Holocaust education program is to learn where racism can ultimately lead, to learn the potential dangers of conformity and to learn about the importance of upholding individual rights and freedoms and the rule of law.”

    NOTHING FROM QUEBEC: In Nova Scotia, one respondent wrote:
    The goals of Holocaust Education Programs are to provide students with an understanding of the prevalence of Nazi-driven anti-Semitism during the WWII period, develop within students, an appreciation of Jewish culture and to foster students’ commitment to anti-racism education and the development of a tolerant and diverse society.

    As one teacher put it: “The Holocaust has been included in my course for all of the fifteen years that I have taught history”

    As for your racist comment that all I’m interested in are Jewish issues instead of: Champlain – Jacques Cartier etc…. here’s another little piece of history you obviously don’t know about: John Cabot discovered and claimed North America for Henry VII in
    1497!!!!!!!!!!! Long before Champlain came along.

    American Historical Documents, 1000–1904.
    The Harvard Classics. 1909–14.

    John Cabot’s Discovery of North America

    (1497)

    [Giovanni Caboto (John Cabot) was a native of Genoa and a citizen of Venice, who obtained letters-patent from Henry VII of England in 1496 for a voyage of discovery. In the summer of 1497, he crossed the Atlantic and discovered the mainland of North America—probably the Labrador coast. On this achievement was based the claim of England to North America.”

    Like I said, get back to me when you grow up.

    Didi

    June 2, 2009 at 10:20 am

  24. Oh did, keep up the good job will you. I like you a lot….we nned guy’s like you, they are the best. Now you showed your true face. You are so good.

    I do agree with you all the way. This province is the most anti-semitic place the entire planet has ever seen. the PQ is the most racist political party to have ever existed. This place is so ethno-centric that 100 000 jewish people, 80 000 italians, 70 000 greeks, 50 000 portugueses, 80 000 haitians, 600 000 english speaking people, 100 000 natives, 20 000 armenians, 40 000 lebanese, 40 000 north african, 70 000 asians (including chinese, vietnamese etc…), descendent or irish, scottish, polish and many other groups as well as more and more pakistanese, latinos (despite the harsh winters) etc… are all living in fear in the greater Montreal area. They all walk with swastikas on their arm, they are all forced to learn french (oh my god!), they are all obliged to speak french on a daily basis, oblige to watch french TV, oblige to listen to french radio and quebecois music and they are all obliged to go to catholic church on sunday’s.

    I know, i know…..it’s terrible to live here.

    These terrible french quebecois bastards dont even know that John Cabot discovered Canada. They think that jacques-Cartier discoverd it, what a stupid bunch of low class people, right didi ?

    I mean i truly believe you, if the holocaust isn’t being teached in school prior to grade 11 it must be deep anti-semitic roots that is soon to explode and turn this hell of a place into the worlds biggest nightmare.

    How can we live in such place didi ? What can we do ? Where can we go ? Give me some hint and i will follow you…i will try to convince all the non pure laine quebecois to get the hell out of here unless they are ready to surrender completely to the master race, the anglo-british race, right didi ?

    Do you think we are capable of doing so didi ?

    Me and you….and maybe Howard Galganov, i am sure he will jump in.

    Keep up the good work didi…..we need you !

    Steve_36

    June 2, 2009 at 9:40 pm

  25. Oh, i forgot to thank you for your historical facts about John cabot who first ”discovered” North American and ”probably” Newfounland !!!

    I wonder why he didn’t make a settlement but i have a clue…..he knew this place was so ethno-centric and that racism was all over the place that he couldn’t get off his boat……i mean he was a great man after all…

    While Jacques-Cartier decided to sail all the way down to Montreal (back then Hochelaga) and make contact with the natives he probably spilled his hatred and his anti-semitism right away……it’s a fact !

    Then came Champlain who founded Quebec which is the oldest still ”running” city in orth america. i wonder why cabot never founded it……Ah….. he felt something was wrong there…. i would have done the same didi….how can one settle in a place that will one day become the most ethno-centric-racist hub in the world….

    He was right all along Cabot…..right to not do anything, to not do any settlement and right to warn the newly arrived immigrants about the upcoming Pequistes.

    Wow…what about history ! You are a genius didi…..keep them coming, i am learning so much from your diatribe !!! I am free this friday afternoon…want to go to Willensky’s for a drink and a talk about history, i feel i will learn so much from you ?

    Steve_36

    June 2, 2009 at 9:50 pm

  26. Speaking of subsidies, did you hear the one about transfer payments and how the “have” provinces, which just so happen to be anglophone fork over billions of dollars to the “have not provinces”, where the biggest one just so happens to be Quebec. So I guess you could say…. Oh never mind. ;)

    Davey Anglophone

    July 25, 2009 at 3:23 am

  27. Like it or not, English is by far and away the worlds de-facto language, and will be first or second language of everyone on the planet soon. Your argument that there is not enough German and Chinese speakers amongst Indian support staff is besides the point.

    You bring up good points but your arguments are weak. They are invalid on almost every single point. (3% subsidizing the 90% – that doesn’t even make sense). McGill and Concordia were built by the Anglo communities, and are somewhat supported by the Quebec government… why by the way is subsidized by the rest of Canada. If you want to get into a ‘who pays for what’ debate, Quebec will usually lose. Especially now that the prairies and Newfoundland have oil, and Quebec seperatist scared most of the financial sector out of Montreal to Toronto, Quebec is on the bottom and Cirque-du-Soleil will not bail you out.

    James

    November 3, 2009 at 3:43 pm

  28. I invoke Godwin’s law.

    Also, my dad can beat up your dad.
    Also, everyone read up on your John Lennon, Jacques Derrida, Willy Brandt and Yitzhak Rabin.

    I remember Barenboim played Wagner and Zhang Ziyi played a Japanese Geisha. Obama’s president, and Eminem can rap. George Harrison’s got his sitar and Super Junior has a violin. Waspy badminton is now Chinese and India’s chess is now Russian. Shigeru Miyamoto draws Italian moustached men, while Canadians drive Toyota and Honda and fly Brazil’s Embraer; while Bombardier goes into maglevs Somewhere there’s a kid out there figuring out the P=NP problem, establishing a nation on the chans, resolving magnetic monopoles, or creating a new medium of social communication based on open exchange, but not Montreal — we’ve got culture and identity from history.

    What’s the argument about? I forget. But arguing over a dead cat is fun, no?

    legibus

    November 25, 2009 at 11:47 pm

  29. Bullshit. There is two French-only colleges in Winnipeg alone, let alone the whole of Canada.

    Well done, AFG. More separatist propoganda for the sheep.

    D.I.D.

    March 7, 2010 at 12:11 am

  30. @AngryFrenchGuy:
    You claim to be the only source where the truth about Quebeck can be found? LOL… I suggest to ALL readers of the bullshit article above, especially if you’re going to enroll in University – do as much research as possible. The TRUTH may be a bit difficult to find at first; (a lot of Que., history has been re-written by the Separtist and current Govt’s) but it is out there. AFG: first and typical PQ lie, is the population of English speaking Quebeckers. English speaking Quebeckers have been catagorized into multiple ethnicities in QC & by Stats Canada. There are Anglos: Those born in Quebec or Canada: Then there are the: Brits, The Scots, The Irish, Americans, Jews, etc…
    Then: there are the ALLOS: Italians etc… whose first or second language is English. The French are listed as. French and French Canadain. The aim of all of this is to confuse the hell out of anyone who doesn’t have the time to devote to this maze of confusion. The TRUE number of ANGLO Quebeckers is: 989,794 in the Montreal area. (big article written about it in the Gazette last year). What they forgot to mention were the 1.5+ million English Speaking Allophones – etc..in la belle province. Most living in the greater Montreal area. The minimum number of English speaking Quebeckers is: 2.5 MILLION!!!
    Always consider the SOURCE – especially when it has to do with English population in Quebeck. They are trying to JUSTIFY the ethnic cleansing of the English out of Quebec. As though anyone in their right minds would do so. But again.. since the ‘language law’ came into effect: The insane have been running the asylum. Remember – consider your source and do your homework.

    DidiM

    March 8, 2010 at 9:45 am


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